September 3, 2024 • 1hr 27min

Bret Taylor - The Agent Era - [Invest Like the Best, EP.386]

Invest Like the Best with Patrick O'Shaughnessy

In this episode of Invest Like the Best, host Patrick O'Shaughnessy interviews Bret Taylor, co-founder of Sierra (a conversational AI platform) and chairman of the board at OpenAI. Bret has an impressive background, having built Google Maps, served as CTO of Facebook, founded Quip, and been co-CEO of Salesforce, among other accomplishments. The conversation focuses on the past, present and future of AI agents - autonomous programs that can reason and take action. Bret believes agents will become a meaningful part of the future and transform how we interact with technology. They discuss strategic approaches to AI integration, different categories of agents, and key considerations for companies building and deploying this technology.

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Key Takeaways

AI agents are systems that can reason and take action autonomously. They will become a meaningful part of the future and transform how we interact with technology.
There are three main categories of AI agents:
- Company agents - Branded conversational AI for customer interactions
- Persona-based agents - Internal agents that do specific jobs (e.g. software engineering, legal work)
- Personal agents - Assistants that help individuals with tasks
Progress in AI capabilities will likely be iterative with occasional big jumps. As models improve, they can be given more agency but will also require more sophisticated safety measures.
Key challenges in building robust AI agents include:
- Designing effective conversational experiences
- Balancing control vs creativity/agency
- Ensuring reliability and safety at scale
Companies should adopt AI internally and externally to prepare for disruption. This includes building customer-facing AI agents and empowering employees to use AI tools.
The future of human-computer interaction may shift towards more natural conversational interfaces powered by multimodal AI models.
OpenAI's unique nonprofit structure with a for-profit subsidiary allows it to pursue its mission of beneficial AGI while raising necessary capital.
Key values for companies building AI technology include intensity (urgency and attention to detail) and craftsmanship (care for quality in all aspects).
To prepare for the "agent era", companies should clearly define the core value they provide customers, beyond just their current delivery model.

Introduction

In this episode of Invest Like the Best, host Patrick O'Shaughnessy interviews Bret Taylor, co-founder of Sierra (a conversational AI platform) and chairman of the board at OpenAI. Bret has an impressive background, having built Google Maps, served as CTO of Facebook, founded Quip, and been co-CEO of Salesforce, among other accomplishments.

The conversation focuses on the past, present and future of AI agents - autonomous programs that can reason and take action. Bret believes agents will become a meaningful part of the future and transform how we interact with technology. They discuss strategic approaches to AI integration, different categories of agents, and key considerations for companies building and deploying this technology.

Topics Discussed

The Mythical Man-Month and Small Team Dynamics (3:05)

Bret explains the concept of the "mythical man-month" - the mistaken idea that adding more people to a software project will make it go faster. He notes that often the inverse is true, as small, high-functioning teams can be more effective:

Small teams allow for a systems-level understanding of the project
Less overhead and bureaucracy enables more agility and rapid decision-making
Team members understand the "why" behind their work, not just the "what"

Bret shares the story of rewriting Google Maps early in his career, highlighting how a small empowered team was able to rapidly improve the codebase based on accumulated lessons.

Defining AI Agents (13:49)

Bret provides his definition of AI agents:

Systems that can reason and take action autonomously
Agentic systems can make decisions and act without human intervention
The concept isn't new, but recent AI advances have made agents much more effective

He outlines three main categories of AI agents:

Company agents - Branded conversational AI for customer interactions (e.g. Sierra's platform)
Persona-based agents - Internal agents that do specific jobs (e.g. software engineering, legal work)
Personal agents - Assistants that help individuals with tasks like planning or email triage

The Evolution of AI Agent Capabilities (18:02)

Bret discusses how AI agent capabilities may progress:

Progress will likely be iterative with occasional big jumps in capabilities
As models improve, they can be given more agency but will require more sophisticated safety measures
Key areas for improvement:
- Reasoning capabilities
- Tool use
- Internet access
- Memory/context

He emphasizes the need for responsible, iterative deployment with appropriate safeguards at each stage.

Challenges in Building Robust AI Agents (26:28)

Bret outlines some key challenges in developing effective AI agents:

Designing conversational experiences - A new discipline requiring different approaches than traditional UX design
Balancing control vs creativity - Finding the right level of agency to give the AI
Ensuring reliability at scale - Making systems that are consistently accurate and safe
Integrating with existing systems - Connecting AI agents to take meaningful actions

He notes that it's easy to make an AI demo, but much harder to build industrial-grade systems that are reliable and safe at scale.

The Future of Human-Computer Interaction (55:08)

Bret shares his thoughts on how AI may change how we interact with technology:

Multimodal models enabling more natural interfaces combining speech, text, and visuals
Conversational AI as a more intuitive way to interact, like in science fiction
Potential for technology to "recede into the background" despite being more powerful
Experimentation with new interface paradigms beyond smartphones (e.g. AR/VR, brain-computer interfaces)

He's excited about the potential for AI to make technology more accessible and reduce friction in human-computer interaction.

OpenAI's Unique Structure (1:05:21)

Bret explains OpenAI's unusual organizational structure:

Fundamentally a Delaware nonprofit with a mission to ensure AGI benefits humanity
Created a for-profit subsidiary to raise necessary capital for AGI development
Board members are fiduciaries to the mission rather than shareholders
Structure aims to balance mission-driven focus with ability to raise significant funding

Building Companies in the AI Era (1:01:22)

Bret discusses how AI may impact business models and company structures:

Companies should consider how automation could reshape their operations
New AI-native competitors may emerge with different cost structures and business models
Incumbents need to adopt AI internally and externally to avoid disruption
Importance of maintaining customer relationships and domain expertise while embracing new technology

Key Values for AI Companies (1:14:03)

Bret highlights two core values for Sierra:

1. Intensity

Reflects urgency and focus needed in fast-moving AI landscape
Caring deeply about every detail and moving quickly
Creating a palpable sense of drive throughout the company culture

2. Craftsmanship

Attention to quality in all aspects - products, communications, interactions
Builds trust, especially important for new technology
Attracts talent who take pride in their work

Preparing for the "Agent Era" (1:21:57)

Bret offers advice for companies preparing for widespread AI adoption:

Clearly define core value proposition - Understand the "job" customers hire you to do, beyond current delivery model
Build a customer-facing AI agent - Start small, but have an AI touchpoint for customers
Empower employees to use AI internally - Allow experimentation to surface valuable use cases
Maintain openness to how AI might reshape roles and processes

Conclusion

This wide-ranging conversation explores the transformative potential of AI agents across business and society. Bret Taylor provides valuable insights on the current state and future trajectory of this technology, drawing on his extensive experience building influential tech companies and products.

Key themes include the need for responsible, iterative development of AI capabilities, the importance of craftsmanship and intentional design in building AI systems, and how companies can strategically prepare for an "agent era" where AI becomes a primary interface for customer interactions and internal processes.

As AI continues to advance rapidly, Bret emphasizes the opportunity for more natural and accessible human-computer interaction. However, he also highlights the challenges in ensuring these powerful systems are reliable, safe, and aligned with human values. Overall, the discussion paints a picture of AI agents as a transformative technology that will reshape how we work and interact with computers, while underscoring the need for thoughtful development and deployment.