January 16, 2023 • 2hr 55min

Rick Rubin: How to Access Your Creativity

Huberman Lab

In this episode, Andrew Huberman interviews Rick Rubin, one of the most renowned and prolific music producers of all time. They discuss Rubin's new book "The Creative Act: A Way of Being" and explore the creative process, how to access creativity, and Rubin's insights from decades of working with top artists across genres. Rubin is known for his work with artists like Run DMC, Public Enemy, Beastie Boys, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Johnny Cash, Adele, and many more. The conversation covers topics like finding inspiration, the role of feelings as guideposts, learning from nature, balancing self-doubt and anxiety, adopting new perspectives, and practical approaches to channeling creativity.

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Key Takeaways

Creativity is elusive and difficult to define - It's more like magic than science and language is insufficient to fully capture it
Ideas and creativity are like clouds - They are constantly shifting and changing, difficult to pin down
Children tend to be more naturally creative as they are open and don't have preconceived notions or baggage
Creativity involves following a feeling or energy in your body, not an intellectual process
The creative process requires being open to the unexpected and following threads of interest, not forcing outcomes
Nature and the physical world can be great sources of creative inspiration
Self-doubt can be useful in the creative process if used as a tool for improvement rather than undermining yourself
Deadlines and structure can be helpful in later stages of the creative process, but are detrimental in early exploratory phases
Disengaging from creative work when not actively doing it allows the subconscious to process
Meditation and practices like watching wrestling can help clear the mind and access creativity
Being present and paying attention to clues in the world around you is key for creativity

Introduction

In this episode, Andrew Huberman interviews Rick Rubin, one of the most renowned and prolific music producers of all time. They discuss Rubin's new book "The Creative Act: A Way of Being" and explore the creative process, how to access creativity, and Rubin's insights from decades of working with top artists across genres.

Rubin is known for his work with artists like Run DMC, Public Enemy, Beastie Boys, Red Hot Chili Peppers, Johnny Cash, Adele, and many more. The conversation covers topics like finding inspiration, the role of feelings as guideposts, learning from nature, balancing self-doubt and anxiety, adopting new perspectives, and practical approaches to channeling creativity.

Topics Discussed

The Elusive Nature of Creativity (8:17)

Creativity is difficult to define and capture in language
It's more like magic than science
Ideas and creativity are like clouds - constantly shifting and changing
"It's sort of how this, the art making process works, is like we're making things and we're looking for a feeling in ourselves, and it could be a feeling of excitement or enthusiasm, a feeling of interest, a feeling of curiosity." - Rick Rubin

Children and Creativity (12:49)

Children tend to be more naturally creative as they are open and don't have preconceived notions
They see things as they are without filters or baggage
As we get older we learn rules and are inspired by others, which can undermine pure creativity

Feelings as Guideposts for Creativity (17:36)

Creativity involves following a feeling or energy in your body
It's not an intellectual process
Rick describes it as "a surge of energy" in the body
First experienced this feeling listening to The Beatles as a young child

Rules, Choice and Art (22:01)

Rules can be helpful as scaffolding but should be broken when needed in art
Sometimes imposing limitations can force creative problem-solving
Trusting your own taste is crucial - don't undermine it for commercial reasons
"I'm doing me, and I'm showing you who I am, and you can like it or not. But either way, this is still how I see it." - Rick Rubin on artistic integrity

Changing Perspective and Creativity (30:20)

Changing perspective or aperture is key to presenting something new
Comedy often works by showing a familiar truth from a new angle
Scientific breakthroughs can seem obvious in hindsight
Question assumptions and consider throwing out existing knowledge

Nature as a Source of Inspiration (41:27)

The natural world provides near infinite options and variations
Observing nature can reveal how limited our normal perception is
The ocean, clouds, etc. have predictable elements but are also chaotic
This combination of structure and unpredictability is creatively inspiring

Focus, Disengaging and the Subconscious (1:04:14)

Total focus and dedication during creative work is important
When not actively working, disengage completely
Don't bring work home or continue thinking about it
This allows the subconscious to process
Engage fully in other projects between sessions

Anxiety and the Creative Process (1:05:53)

Anxiety is common at the start of new projects due to uncertainty
Rick feels anxious until finding the first creative thread to follow
Anxiety can be a form of readiness or mobilizing energy
"There's always a sense of anxiety, because I know whatever's gonna happen is completely out of my control." - Rick Rubin

Collaboration and Rigorous Work (1:13:22)

Many artists are more serious and focused on craft than their public personas suggest
Cites example of Floyd Mayweather's intense private training regimen
Public perceptions often don't match the rigorous work behind the scenes

Wrestling as Creative Inspiration (1:35:38)

Rick watches wrestling regularly and finds it creatively inspiring
Maintains a playful "anything is possible" mindset
Blurs lines between reality and fiction in an interesting way
Relaxing to watch as the stakes feel low
"I think in some ways wrestling's more honest or legitimate, because we start with the idea that it's fixed." - Rick Rubin

Sleep, Waking Up and Capturing Ideas (2:01:56)

Rick has a slow wake-up process, taking about an hour
Tries to get sunlight exposure first thing in the morning
Goes for a walk and listens to lectures/podcasts/audiobooks
Captures ideas in phone notes if they come
Avoids engaging too much too soon after waking

Creative Work Phases (2:08:16)

Rick outlines 4 phases of creative work:
1. Seed collecting - ongoing gathering of interesting ideas
2. Experimentation - trying things out with collected seeds
3. Crafting - shaping and combining ideas
4. Completion - final edits and finishing
Deadlines can be helpful in later phases but detrimental early on
Move flexibly between phases as needed

Self-Doubt and Performance (2:15:32)

Self-doubt is natural and can be useful if not undermining
Can push you to improve and question if work is the best it can be
Confidence is good but some doubt allows for growth
"You can doubt your way to a great work, you know, to a masterpiece." - Rick Rubin

Meditation Practices (2:48:07)

Rick has practiced meditation since age 14, starting with TM
Describes different types:
- Mantra meditation
- Breath focus
- Awareness meditation
Typically meditates first thing in the morning
Sometimes does very long sessions, like entire flights
Finds it powerfully relaxing and healing

Conclusion

This wide-ranging conversation between Andrew Huberman and Rick Rubin provides fascinating insights into the creative process from one of music's most accomplished producers. Rubin emphasizes the importance of following feelings and energy rather than intellect, being open to the unexpected, learning from nature, and cultivating presence and attention.

He outlines practical approaches like total focus during work sessions balanced with complete disengagement between, and breaking the creative process into phases. Rubin also discusses the roles of anxiety, self-doubt, meditation, and even professional wrestling in accessing creativity. Overall, the episode offers a wealth of wisdom on nurturing creativity applicable far beyond just music or art.